35 replies to this topic

[dagge]

Mad Alchemist, on Mar 10 2009, 06:50 PM, said:

Come on, think before you write. For some people it's not a problem to see-hear whether things are right, but there are those who aren't that good so far. People who only started playing guitar and\or studying music theory recently won't be able to tell if you wrote the wrong thing. They'll probably play it for months this way.

The chorus is F5, C5, D5, G5, you misplaced chords. And the Edim chord is wrong too. It should be one fret higher: watch the video, he obviously places his first finger on the seventh (dotted fret). And there's certainly E in the bass.
I mean, come on, it's okay to have different theories on what he plays because the video has shitty youtube quality of sound and video, but let's not bring up things that are obviously wrong.

Sorry, didn't mean at all to turn anybody into a jerk. I just saw that some people wrote "it's a blablabla" and it wasn't, so those that really wonders just getting confused.

Yeah, you're right, it's C5 before D5. And you're right about the dim-chord as well, actually it's a Fdim to a G#dim, both played with low E in the bass, just to add some fatness. And to those that thinks what dim is, it means dimnished, which means that you put minor thirds och each following note. So in this case, when it's a Fdim, you add the minor third to the F, which is a Ab, and then add the minor third to the Ab, which is a B, and the add the minor third to the B, which happens to be a D.
Imagine to play a normal 7 chord. Play a E7 with root note at the seveth fret on A-string, and the slide your finger up a half note, and there you got the new root note and the dim-chord.

The Fdim can be played either

E --7-------5--
B --9-------3--
G --7-- or -5--
D --9-------3--
A --8----------
E -------------

John is playing it the first way, with the open E-string, like this

E --7--------------11--
B --9--------------12--
G --7-- and then --10--
D --9-----G#dim----12--
A --8--------------11--
E --0--------------0---

That's the 100 per cent correct way to play it, nothing else.

[Mad Alchemist]

Yep, that's right, in this context it's not Fdim.

[dagge]

nowordsysyworld, on Mar 11 2009, 08:15 PM, said:

& this chord is called E 7 9b (b=flat)

Mad Alchemist, on Mar 11 2009, 10:05 PM, said:

Yep, that's right, in this context it's not Fdim.

Well, that's true. The Fdim/E contents the same notes as an E7b9, but I would rather prefer to call it a Fdim/E and Gdim/E, as it's acutally a Fdim with a E in the bass. He's even saying in the video, "you're playing these, sort of like dimnished notes, so you feel like it's alright to move up to the minor third". Just the idea of dim-chords.

If you would teach somebody this song, and you would say "a E7b9", they would play

-X-
-6-
-7-
-6-
-7-
-X-

but if you would say "a Fdim/E", which it acutally is, they would get it in one second.

[dagge]

nowordsysyworld, on Mar 12 2009, 01:31 PM, said:

i definitely concur on being dydactical

Yeah, that's true in a kind of way. But actually, the fifth doesn't matter. In many chords (like maj9 chords on guitar), you don't play the fifth cause it isn't important, and tbecuase the guitar has some limitations in comparision to a piano for example. In some chords, you can't play every notes, so then you don't play the fifth 'cause it's less important. And when you omit a note, you say "no 5" instead of "-5", because that can be confused with "b5". Just a little thing. And actually, the fifth can be played in a E7b9, just play the seventh freth of the first E-string I think.

I wouldn't say it's wrong to call that Gone Too Fast-chord for a E7b9, but I think it's very stupid, since it's 100 per cent correct to just call it a Fdim/E.

[Mad Alchemist]

I disagree. Remember where this discussion goes from: I mentioned that these two chords play the role of dominant. It feels like E major chord is being played. They have dominant function so in this context I'd rather call them E-whatever than anything else.

[dagge]

Mad Alchemist, on Mar 12 2009, 03:28 PM, said:

I disagree. Remember where this discussion goes from: I mentioned that these two chords play the role of dominant. It feels like E major chord is being played. They have dominant function so in this context I'd rather call them E-whatever than anything else.

But the song is in Am, am I right? Then the dominant is Em, not E.

[Mad Alchemist]

dagge, on Mar 12 2009, 11:17 PM, said:

But the song is in Am, am I right? Then the dominant is Em, not E.

Wrong, the dominant is E for both Am and A.

Edit: I mean, in everyday life. Techincally, if you read the book, you'll see, that dominant chord v in minor is indeed a minor triad. But in western music minor is traditionally harmonized, so the V (major fifth) chord is used as dominant. Whenever I say "dominant" I mean "major fifh chord", whether it's minor or major, and all the musicians I know do the same. That's what I meant.

[JForsblade]

Mad Alchemist, on Mar 9 2009, 02:14 AM, said:

"Major vs Parallel minor" is an old old argument. True, sometimes it's really hard to realize what's going on and you just go with "Am \ C" or "D#m \ F#". But it doesn't mean that you can take any song and feel free to choose the key you want. Determining the key may not be the exact science okay, but sometimes it's clear as hell, so you don't need to make a rocket science out of it. It's A minor.

Not to be a nit-picker, but isn't Am and C relative, not parallel? The Parallel of Am is A Major. But you have a good point. A key's a key, you can modulate, but that doesn't mean Am is C, they're not interchangeable.

[Mad Alchemist]

JForsblade, on Nov 10 2009, 08:37 AM, said:

Not to be a nit-picker, but isn't Am and C relative, not parallel? The Parallel of Am is A Major. But you have a good point. A key's a key, you can modulate, but that doesn't mean Am is C, they're not interchangeable.

Well, that surprised me. Thanks, I looked it up in the wikipedia and you're right, the right term in English is "relative", that's what I meant. In my language they call relative keys "parallel", and I would never think that the same word means different thing in English. (I still think that to call those keys "parallel" makes more sense, but I will use "relative" from now on.)

[JForsblade]

Mad Alchemist, on Nov 10 2009, 06:15 AM, said:

JForsblade, on Nov 10 2009, 08:37 AM, said:

Not to be a nit-picker, but isn't Am and C relative, not parallel? The Parallel of Am is A Major. But you have a good point. A key's a key, you can modulate, but that doesn't mean Am is C, they're not interchangeable.

Well, that surprised me. Thanks, I looked it up in the wikipedia and you're right, the right term in English is "relative", that's what I meant. In my language they call relative keys "parallel", and I would never think that the same word means different thing in English. (I still think that to call those keys "parallel" makes more sense, but I will use "relative" from now on.)

Oh, well no problem. It's just that I'm in music theory, and I feel like I must make my teacher proud!