25 replies to this topic

[beejaysus]

Hmm... this will be difficult/impossible. Johnfrusciante.com says of Niandra:

"The specifics of Equipment used on Niandra are not all that clear. There are some obvious elements there, such electric and acoustic guitars, as well as piano. But the surprising thing is, is that John also plays Bass, as well as Banjo here. He recorded and mastered the album himself, without much help from American Recordings."

I don't here much bass on there. Or am I going deaf? What do you think?

And of Smile:

"Because Smiles consists of different recording periods, ranging from 1988 to 1996, it's hard to pinpoint what was used during the recording of Smiles. Acoustic and Electric guitars run through out this album and was recorded on 4track recorders and rarely, a stereo system."

Maybe he used the BSSM acoustics on these albums. The maton 12 string and the Martin 6 string? Ah fuck, who knows!!!

I definitely hear a lot of the Jaguar on these albums. That same sprangy sound you hear in Under the Bridge.
http://www.invisible-movement.net/v/zother...997_15.jpg.html
I think that's the blue one. And I'm guessing that might have been what he used here.

It might be worth taking a look at the "Stuff" movie to see what he had lying around his house. Some clues perhaps?

[Lennart]

beejaysus, on Jan 17 2008, 10:57 PM, said:

I definitely hear a lot of the Jaguar on these albums. That same sprangy sound you hear in Under the Bridge.
http://www.invisible-movement.net/v/zother...997_15.jpg.html
I think that's the blue one. And I'm guessing that might have been what he used here.

He didnt use a Jaguar for Under the Brigde and that sprangy sound is compression. On Niandra you hear a lot of natural compression from his taperecorder.

[beejaysus]

Lennart, on Jan 19 2008, 04:58 PM, said:

He didnt use a Jaguar for Under the Brigde and that sprangy sound is compression. On Niandra you hear a lot of natural compression from his taperecorder.

How do you know he didn't use the Jaguar for UTB?, I'm curious, as I've only ever read the opposite.

I know there's compression on it, probably a UA1176. I play a strat through an EHX White Finger into a Fender 2x12 tube amp, and even if I dig in with my fingers and nails I still can't get the same sound in that intro. I think there's something else going on.... I think it's a Jag- but please... prove me wrong

As for the natural compression you mentioned. While tape does compress naturally when pushed hard, only a quality machine like Ampex, Studer, Otari etc. will give any kind of decent natural compression.

A crappy 4 track on casette or even 1/4" tape will not compress when pushed hard. It will turn to shit. Sadly. That's why the're so cheap

[Lennart]

beejaysus, on Jan 19 2008, 09:38 PM, said:

Lennart, on Jan 19 2008, 04:58 PM, said:

He didnt use a Jaguar for Under the Brigde and that sprangy sound is compression. On Niandra you hear a lot of natural compression from his taperecorder.

How do you know he didn't use the Jaguar for UTB?, I'm curious, as I've only ever read the opposite.

Cause a Jaguar doesn't sound like that

[triplepant]

Lennart, on Jan 20 2008, 12:40 PM, said:

beejaysus, on Jan 19 2008, 09:38 PM, said:

Lennart, on Jan 19 2008, 04:58 PM, said:

He didnt use a Jaguar for Under the Brigde and that sprangy sound is compression. On Niandra you hear a lot of natural compression from his taperecorder.

How do you know he didn't use the Jaguar for UTB?, I'm curious, as I've only ever read the opposite.

Cause a Jaguar doesn't sound like that

we need written proof...
I also think that he used a Jaguar on the original recording of UTB. Why else would he use it in the video? But he also said it somewhere in an interview.
But this discussion doesn't belong in this topic...

[beejaysus]

Ok we got a little sidetracked there!

Does anybody have any ideas/info about this period before we move on?

All the other threads have produced good results. Not this one though

[SiberianKhatru]

I think I remember reading an interview from around 1994 or so where the interviewer mentioned seeing a Moog looking synthesizer at John's house...I am guessing he was talking about a Korg MS10 (since John has an MS10).

[iamquinn]

John playing banjo?! I don't think the person who wrote this quite knew what they were talking about. There was clarinet and mandolin in some of those recordings, but no banjo.
I think he did play bas for on a few songs, but certainly not on the whole album.

[Iva]

What is the instrument on Big Takeover, then?
I assume it's not a guitar...

[Mr. Maniac]

looks like a banjo

[Iva]

Even the file's title is "jfbanjo".

[beejaysus]

I'd be willing to call it a banjo

It's hard to tell though. Mandolin and Clarinet???? I must be going deaf. Point out examples if you really think he did though

SiberianKhatru, on Jan 29 2008, 11:42 PM, said:

I think I remember reading an interview from around 1994 or so where the interviewer mentioned seeing a Moog looking synthesizer at John's house...I am guessing he was talking about a Korg MS10 (since John has an MS10).

I think the Korg was "To Record Only Water..." era. But since John says "DC EP" was his first recording without any synth he obviously used synth on there somewhere. Does anyone know where? Again with the deafness

[SiberianKhatru]

I am pretty sure he used filters on his voice in I May Again Know John, and there is also a little bit at the end of Enter a Uh (like literally one note) that is definitely a synthesizer. Also on Ants, I think there are small sequences around :45, 1:21, and 1:37 that are synthesizers.

[Mr. Maniac]

it sounds like a distortion and a flanger (????) in I May Again Know John

[Iva]

SiberianKhatru, on Feb 21 2008, 04:37 PM, said:

Also on Ants, I think there are small sequences around :45, 1:21, and 1:37 that are synthesizers.

I thought there was more of it...?
Ohwell, so obvious I'm not a musician.

[snork]

I'm pretty certain he used a Tascam MKII 4-track (not sure on the exact model #) on Niandra, and maybe bits of Smile. He ran his guitar straight into the board with much of Niandra. Sorry, I don't remember the source on that but I'm sure it's lurking in an interview on this site. I can also confirm this because I own a 4 track in this line (the 424 mkII) and my guitar sounds identical when plugged into the board. Many of the effects on Niandra are actually just tape speed variation. It wouldn't surprise me to find out he didn't use compression, or much of anything on Niandra and Smile. He did after all make these recordings just for himself and only later decide to release them.

Edit: I just noticed the debate on the "sprangy" sound on Niandra. This is almost certainly the 4-tracks preamps you're hearing. Again, I would be very surprised to find out he did anything other than plug the guitar straight into the board. No outboard compression on Niandras guitars imo. I would even go so far as to say the 4-track is the source of much of the distortion (voice and guitar), but that's just speculation.

[SiberianKhatru]

I found some clarinet (I think) at the very end of Nigger Song, although there's not very much of it. There is also definite synthesizer in Running Away Into You, at the end of I May Again Know John, in Nigger Song (around 1:30), and I'm pretty sure in A Fall Thru The Ground.
Also in terms of the 4 track, it definitely was not a 424 mkII since those didn't come out until 1996 or so. It could be just the original 424 though.

[beejaysus]

Ok, so I put up a roundup of all this stuff in the main gear thread:

http://forums.invisible-movement.net/index...amp;#entry72863

We still haven't got anything about bass, I mentioned that in the first post. The guitars thing went nowhere and I went with the Moog instead of the Korg, but I could be wrong. I guess there are a few other niggly bits too, but as I said, it's not an easy era to get info on.

[snork]

SiberianKhatru, on Feb 26 2008, 05:51 AM, said:

Also in terms of the 4 track, it definitely was not a 424 mkII since those didn't come out until 1996 or so. It could be just the original 424 though.

Agreed, I edited out the 424 part and forgot to adjust the mkII. My understanding is that the preamps are the same on these units though, so regarding the sound they'd be near identical.

In any case, I'm quite sure the "amp" that he used was the 4-track on all/many of the Niandra songs.


Edit: Actually, I stopped being lazy and a 2 sec google search reveals... its a 424 portastudio that he used per the 92 VPRO interview.

[horriblemashup]

BUMP

ok well on the big takeover, john plays a mandolin for the "lead lines"

and thats not a synth on ants, that is most def. his voice through a distortion pedal and god knows what other pedals. its so obviously his voice just screaming. ive made the exact same sound using a mic, distortion pedal, loads of reverb and a pitch shifter set at a really high pitch and just made screaming noises like john and i came out with the exact same sound

its actually my favourite things about ants

he would have used distortion on his voice in i may again know john, there is also some echo effect there on his voice.

a fall thru the ground was recorded when he was, what? 17 years old? its a cheap drum machine for sure playing that hypnotic beat. guitar has distortion and reverb